Dell laptop : Batteries

The disadvantage of buying old laptops is, that you get a lot of old batteries as well. Some of my machines have batteries that are still as good as new. In most cases, these were batteries that were replaced by the former owners. But some others are in very bad shape. On 5 old beasties, I have 6 batteries (one came with a spare battery), of which one is in awful condition (less than 10 minutes runtime) and most are in reasonable shape (40 - 60 minutes runtime).

So the thought crossed my mind to get some 'new' batteries. First I skimmed Marktplaats.nl, a dutch used-goods site. Either the offerings were suspicious, or the seller wanted almost the newprice. And I don't want to pay newprice on this kind of tricky product. Especially not on marktplaats, which is famous for its return policy: after you paid, all waranty is out the window.

Dell laptop : Batteries on Ebay

On Ebay my kind of battery (75UYF) is very well represented. At least, that's what they say. If you read the fine print, 99.9% of the lots are for 'generic' or 'OEM' batteries that are drop in replacements for the 75UYF. With the advantage that these batteries are 4500 mAh, whereas the original was 3800 mAh.

Most of these replacement batteries are from China. In itself that does not mean a thing. Everything is made in China, nowadays. Still, China is not always China. There are lots of copy cat companies that mimmick a battery casing and then hope for the best. The trick is to filter these out. And I don't have a clue how to do that, without inviting a few batteries over for the weekend.

So I chose an Ebay supplier that looked trustworthy (feedback score) and had a good shipping policy. I ordered two replacement batteries (Brandnew and with 6 months of warranty) for €35 each. A steal, when compared to other shops that sell batteries for more than €120 a piece. I ordered the batteries on Friday and received them home on Tuesday. Not bad for an international shipment.

Dell laptop : Battery experiences

For some reason I had a bad feeling when I received the envelope with the two batteries inside. I put this aside. I'm an engineer and engineers don't feel. They experience and measure. These are my findings:

  1. I inserted the battery in my CPx laptop to give it its initial charge. This was not particularly easy. The charge would start and then stop after a mere 10 minutes. Of course this cannot be true. A 3800 mAh battery takes a few hours to charge so a 4600 mAh cell should take even longer.
    Still, after fiddling about (swapping batteries, different laptops, different chargers) I managed to get both new replacement batteries charged.
  2. The batteries had a poor fit. It was kind of hard to insert them in the bays in the front of the laptops. And getting them out was almost impossible. Also, the battery connector had a bad mating with the receptacle in the computer. It didn't increase my assurance in these products.
  3. I inserted my best Dell battery in the C600 and got it running X with a 'difficult' screensaver. The 3800 mAh cell took 3 hours to get depleted.
    Then I inserted the brand new battery in the C600 and looked how long the battery would last. After 3 hours, it had still 25% charge left. Total time would be close to 4 hours. Not bad for such a cheap battery.
    So I inserted the power cord and tried to recharge the battery. I knew from yesterday that this could cause some problems. It cost a lot of problems. No matter what I did I could not get ANY charge in it. It would set the 'Charge' LED on and after 10 minutes it would go off, not even blinking to indicate trickle charging.
  4. I repeated the experiment for the other battery. Same 4 hours to go. And the same experience: impossible to recharge. This was a bad deal. So I contacted the Ebay seller and he offered a money back if I returned the batteries. So now they are under way to the UK again.
  5. It seems that Dell does not produce these batteries anymore. There are lots of compatibles around. But you need to read the full text of the ad to find this out. In some cases, they even show a picture of a true Dell 75UYF battery and later (in fine print) mention that it is just an example.
    The batteries I tested were from the company 'Bridge Technology'. If you read their webpage http://bridgecn.en.alibaba.com/ or http://bridgecn.net/en/ or go to http://www.alibaba.com and search for '75uyf' you might become a little bit troubled. They make CD-ROM players and fiddle about with batteries on the side... Looks like they buy no-name batteries and put their own stickers on them. Not the kind of company I was looking for.
    But on Ebay, all shops have their own channels for getting goods to sell. And secrecy about their sources is the base of their income, so don't expect to see any meaningful websites for getting more information. A pitty for us, the buyers, but that's what Ebay is about.
  6. Watch out. It's a jungle out there and they're all after your money. I was lucky with my Ebay seller. You may not be so lucky.

Dell laptop : Once more

After this nasty experience at Ebay I started a massive websearch (Yahoo and Google) for 75UYF batteries or replacements. Dell stopped producing them. Major second source parties (Duracell, EverCell) stopped as well. For the rest, it is difficult to seperate the sheep from the goats. One experience:

A webshop told to be reseller of the brand 'Yanec'. A new Yanec would cost around €100. I did a 'whois' on the webshop and on the Yanec website. They were identical (some hillbilly township in the middle of nowhere, of which I am 100% sure there is NO battery factory or research facility).
The webshop cannot be 'simple reseller' and 'battery developer'. So the Yanec brand is not trustworthy to me. It can only be a cheap clone with a sticker attached by the Yanec development engineers (doing so when the kids are at school).
It may well be that Yanec IS a good brand. It may be so that Yanec knows its way in battery-land and did find a trusty source of OEM batteries. But at the moment I just don't want to set my money on it. Once is enough.

Still, I definitely wanted to get some real Dell 75UYF cells which were in a reasonable state. So I again ended up on marktplaats.nl. The day before someone placed an ad for three batteries in reasonable state. I had to ask the seller some details, did some websearching and came to the conclusion that this would be an acceptable risk. For €50 I will get three cells.

Battery health and battery status

On the backside of the 75UYF is a shallow button. If you press it shortly, the status of the battery is shown: 5 LED's is 100% and each LED less is 20% off. This is the battery status. The battery guesses the status on the basis of the battery pack voltage.

If you press the button above and hold it depressed for 3 - 5 seconds, the status LED's will turn off and during half a second, a series of LED's will blink once. The longer the LED bar that blinks, the worse the health of your battery is. So, if no LED's blink, your battery is brandnew. If 4 or 5 LED's light up, it's time for a reconditioning attempt. Or the toxic waste disposal.
Of course this check only works if there is some charge in the battery (i.e. the status is not zero).

Dell laptop : logging battery state

When discharging a battery, this may take some time. You may do a game or two but soon it starts to be boring. So you want to automate this. I made a program called 'show':

	cat /proc/acpi/battery/BAT0/state
	uptime
   
or, for older kernels:
	apm
	uptime
   
and ran 'crontab -e' with this line:
	* * * * * /home/jan/show >>/home/jan/keepup.log
   
which runs the 'show' script every minute and the output is appended to the log file. Now I can just start the computer, start X and go do something else. Wen the power gets too low, the battery low voltage protection system will cut off power and the laptop will stop logging as well.

Dell laptop : experiences with the used Dell's

The 75UYF's arrived today. I've been running tests with them which are assuring:

  1. Battery 1 was dead as a dodo. It didn't even accept any charge. None of the LED's lit up. This was a disappointment.
    Then I tried to start up from this battery. It did not work. I immediately plugged in the charger. The green light went ON and the battery started charging! After three hours, it was full. The day after I did a discharge test (until the battery cut out) which took close to 4 hours!
  2. Battery 2 showed 1 LED when I checked for status. That was a good sign. The health check, however, showed 4 LED's which means the cell is in a bad shape.
    I charged the cell and ran it in the C600 with the WLAN active. After 20 minutes the battery was depleted. Another disappointment.
    On www.instructables.com I found a tip for reconditioning Li-Ion packs: discharge the pack until it shuts down to reset the fuel gauge built in the battery. Then recharge. While I was searching for this information, the C600 was depleting this battery pack. After one hour it was still going strong!
    Stranger yet: /proc/acpi/battery/BAT0/state showed the remaining capacity to 0% for the last 10 minutes! The battery voltage was dropping to below 14 Volts. The intention was to wait until the battery pack would quit. But at 75 minutes uptime I decided to shut down the system in a controlled way and recharge the battery.

    I did a full discharge (until the battery cut out), recharged and discharged again (with a log file). After 40 minutes the battery reported to be dead (0%) but still managed to run the laptop for close to an hour!

  3. Battery 3 showed 3 LED's when I checked status and zero LED's when I checked health. That was a good sign. So I slipped the battery in Gallium and charged it. During the discharge, it ran for close to 2 hours. Not bad. Perhaps this battery needs a circuit reset as well to see if I can get 3 hours out of it....
As things look now, I have two good and one very good battery. But what I don't understand is: what's wrong with the fuel gauge in battery 2? It behaves erratically (although it is improving). Also, the laptop just asks the battery how good it is. And if the battery reports 'critical', the laptop puts on its yellow light. No questions asked.
Still, the connected laptop keeps on running on a seamingly dead battery... This is the log of the first full discharge (boring parts removed):
present:                 yes
capacity state:          ok
charging state:          discharging
present rate:            26152 mW
remaining capacity:      49280 mWh
present voltage:         14792 mV
 15:10:01 up 17 min,  5 users,  load average: 0.18, 0.13, 0.15
present:                 yes
capacity state:          ok
charging state:          discharging
present rate:            23330 mW
remaining capacity:      37310 mWh
present voltage:         14029 mV
 15:13:01 up 20 min,  5 users,  load average: 0.70, 0.27, 0.19
present:                 yes
capacity state:          ok
charging state:          discharging
present rate:            23355 mW
remaining capacity:      22990 mWh
present voltage:         13927 mV
 15:14:01 up 21 min,  5 users,  load average: 0.92, 0.42, 0.24
present:                 yes
capacity state:          ok
charging state:          discharging
present rate:            23447 mW
remaining capacity:      10840 mWh
present voltage:         13825 mV
 15:15:01 up 22 min,  5 users,  load average: 1.05, 0.55, 0.30
present:                 yes
capacity state:          ok
charging state:          discharging
present rate:            23706 mW
remaining capacity:      1950 mWh
present voltage:         13735 mV
 15:16:01 up 23 min,  5 users,  load average: 0.94, 0.61, 0.33

.................

present:                 yes
capacity state:          ok
charging state:          discharging
present rate:            14417 mW
remaining capacity:      1740 mWh
present voltage:         14121 mV
 15:59:01 up  1:06,  5 users,  load average: 0.00, 0.00, 0.00
present:                 yes
capacity state:          ok
charging state:          discharging
present rate:            16736 mW
remaining capacity:      1110 mWh
present voltage:         14041 mV
 16:01:01 up  1:08,  5 users,  load average: 0.00, 0.00, 0.00
present:                 yes
capacity state:          critical
charging state:          discharging
present rate:            15480 mW
remaining capacity:      660 mWh
present voltage:         14035 mV
 16:02:01 up  1:09,  5 users,  load average: 0.00, 0.00, 0.00
present:                 yes
capacity state:          critical
charging state:          discharging
present rate:            14788 mW
remaining capacity:      260 mWh
present voltage:         14071 mV
 16:03:02 up  1:10,  5 users,  load average: 0.00, 0.00, 0.00
present:                 yes
capacity state:          critical
charging state:          discharging
present rate:            14531 mW
remaining capacity:      0 mWh
present voltage:         14067 mV
 16:04:01 up  1:11,  5 users,  load average: 0.00, 0.00, 0.00

.................

present:                 yes
capacity state:          critical
charging state:          discharging
present rate:            14743 mW
remaining capacity:      0 mWh
present voltage:         11229 mV
 17:10:01 up  2:17,  5 users,  load average: 0.00, 0.00, 0.00
   
So I should run this battery on a system that does not have acpi and low battery warnings running. Still, it is strange.

Dell laptop : CPU loader

I want to test my batteries under load. So the CPU must do something silly. That's why I made the following program in C:

     int main (void)
     {
        here: goto here;
     }
   
compile it with
     $ gcc run.c -o run
     $ strip run
     $ ./run &
   
and run the program while discharging the battery. It will load the CPU for the full 100%.

Dell laptop : my batteries

Below is a table with my batteries plus some details.

Nr type mAh Whr Health Minutes Remarks
1 75UYF 3800 55 Very good 180 This was a replaced battery (in the CPx).
2 75UYF 3800 55 Dead 15 This battery was in the C600, after the repair... It is dead.
3 75UYF 3800 55 Very good 200 -
4 1691P 3600 52 Poor 80 For the first 60 minutes everything goes smooth. And then the system goes from 60% to 10% within minutes. This battery has a high self discharge (empty within three weeks on the shelf).
5 53977 2700 38 Good 90+ Tested in the CPiA running at 100% CPU load (twice the 'run &' command, and then 'startx')
6 3149C 3000 43 Good 100 Tested in the CPiA 366XT with 100% CPU load
7 75UYF 3800 55 Doubtful 50 Good for 20 minutes at first. After a full discharge: 50 minutes when fully loaded. Battery gauge malfunction. Good enough for keeping one of the oldies alive. This was a €20 as well.
8 75UYF 3800 55 Good 120 Good enough for a €20 battery.
9 75UYF 3800 55 Very good 200 Another €20 battery. Dead on arrival. Suddenly started charging. Now as good as new. Strange.

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